Posted by Dave Brewster on April 22, 2000 at 13:05:38:
In Reply to: Re: Kerrys 100,000 dollars worth, that's right gold!! posted by Kerry on April 22, 2000 at 11:01:07:
: It's the nature of any kind of socialist movement and/or revolt. It isn't necessarily pragmatic, now is it? Or comfortable.
: And yes I am saying that a union leader cannot be in the business!! BIG FAT PERIOD!! A conflict of interest will always keep a union weak.
No. There is no conflict at all. Outside, inside, he has no choice over what this private company does with shipping out.
: Please understand that I don't mean being a thug when I refer to a union leader striking fear into production houses, but fear based on the fact that they know he/she will be a walking pain in the butt by finding ways and leverage to put pressure on the big guys and to keep work here.
And from everthing I know , Tom is that pain. I know of things he has done that you would roll your eyes at because they were done for no other reason than to be provoking. If you didn't mean "fear" then you shouldn't have said that. And you mean thugs. You again have no clue. Could you get some ecxperience in this business before you start talking like some throwback ? Exactly what have you done ? Where do you work ?
: You act as if it's impossible. See you are too busy working to think of ways to help, you are too busy saying that the status quo is the only way, that we have no choices, that if we strike the work will disappear.
Excuse me Kerry ? Weren't you the one who said "Snakebite was right". The man who said "keep creating"? Don't give me gibberish about the status quo. I am telling you for a fact. Run Kerry , prove me wrong. If you feel you are so in touch with this industry what is holding you back ?
: Why don't you just say you are happy with the current circumstances and you are fine with the idea of thousands of Asian individuals pumping out the creative whims of Americans while graduating animators might as well stay in school where it is safe.
Kerry, I suggest if you want to continue our discussion you do two things. One, you do not put words in my mouth or assign me blame for things I do not feel or have control of. Two, you get an education. Learn about the business instead of babbling on about things you don't know. It is people like you that mindlessly toss out blame that are the ones to look to for Asian problems. You blindly paraded around pronouncing your superior intentions , superior position while not having a clue about what they were doing. Dont try and lay that at my feet. It makes you look stupid.
: Of course we can't strike when our Union Leader is busy working and if we did strike he would be ringing his hands with worry over his own financial situation.
Oh bullshit. You are so far out of the loop it is almost laughable. We cannot strike because there is a no strike clause. Not because Tom is afraid or greedy. Only an idiot would call a strike when half the membership is unemployed and the business is in retreat. It's called "suicide". Big fat period.
: If we have to we should join forces with a more powerful union, unite with unions in other fields that would empathise with us and make us more powerful. If we shut down they shut down as well, imagine if all the set designers and carpenters on movie lots went on strike for sympathy with us, don't tell me that wouldn't have an impact. Find a union to unite with that has impact here at home with similar productions. The idea is to trip them up and force them to rethink doing business at home.
These are private companies who have their own outlets for properties. They dont have the same sponsorship to answer to as the ones in the sixties. You can go on and on about this but just incase you hadn't noticed almost ALL the unions are diminished. All of them . Not just ours .
: Now you explain to me how a working in the business union leader can work without bias toward getting extreme results which is what we need. He can't turn right or left without conflict of interest popping up. I DO NOT CARE HOW HONORABLE AND FORTHRIGHT HE/SHE IS OR HOW MUCH YOU RESPECT THEM!!!! It's impossible.
The results YOU NEED are either having the President bumping off heads of companies, using blackmail or extortion or going to the bank and financing an entire studio to hire you. It is totally possible to work without bias . He has and until the boom disappeared everyone knew it for. It wasn't until this fall off that people like you started attacking. It never was an issue at any point till that. You are using any excuse to feed your anger.
: We need a dedicated Union leader who can move about freely, free from personal financial worry, and work with other unions, who can brainstorm, can become a media attention getter, who can make our concerns other people concerns.
Then run Kerry. You want a baby sitter who lies to you. One that feeds your ego and pretends you are the greatest and only on earth. Run. Lets see if the rest of the union buys your sixties union bent.
: You don't hire union leaders because they are respectable members of their field. You hire union leaders who can get crap done for members of that union. Who are bigger then life, loud, and dedicated.
Blah blah blah. Tom is not just "respectable".
: You mentioned the steel industry. You act is if what is at stake for us is less important then it was for the steel workers of America. Our well beings and lively hoods are being shipped out of this country. You actually said it sarcastically. I say, Hell Yes, just like the steel workers who won their battles and have watchdogs that watch their interest, so should we.
What are you going on about ? I never said it was less important. We are in the film business Kerry. Something that changes with whims and economic tides . It's hard to bully the opponent that closes down and runs away. Get it ?
: We should look for a union leader from a different field, with a single minded ness of purpose, keep work here and salaries fair. Perhaps we could recruit one from the steel workers union. Don't think that a Union Leader has to know how to draw, paint, or be artsy farsty. It's enough if he understands business and numbers and our interest. But more importantly is charismatic and gets our needs heard.
God , you are so full of shit Kerry. You have now lost me totally . You want to bring in someone who hasn't a clue about any of this god damn business and put the up as some idiotic figure head for a ship that is half below the waves. Until this entire business is at the bottom of the ocean you wont be happy. I think personally you are a fool.
: I know you like Tom and would never question his dedication but it is very easy for us to sit back and see that while you lecture us that you have got a good thing goin on, and Tom does too. If Tom is doing anything but watching out for the union members interest then he is not a good union leader. PERIOD. A union leader can have only one job, being a union leader. Are we supposed to believe he works all day then comes home late at night to work on our problems? Even if he does he cannot work nearly as effectively as someone that is dedicated to our interest throughout the day. Starting his morning by making press releases and stirring up trouble. Now please be honest, how effective can Tom be?
This is my last discussion with you Kerry. You are right about only one thing. You can sit back (way way back) and say because we are both working that we are influenced but not because there is any evidence at all . But because you have no other avenue. What is clear as crystal is that you have no idea what you are talking about. You feel innuendo and implied conspiracy are fact. This job ends in a couple months for both of us. Now had there been some gain from this stance it would only lie in keeping this job long term. You and your theories are as hollow and empty as they could possibly be. Sorry, but if you really thought you were right you should run. Put yourself and your slander up for examination before the membership.
And finally, to your question about how effective Tom can be. I would rather have a president that knows the business from all sides than your crowd inspiring figurehead know nothing. You are for the mindless destruction that brought the Asian studios to success. Bravo. The thing you claim is Toms greatest weakness is Toms greatest strength.
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