Posted by Dave on December 19, 1999 at 02:14:36:
In Reply to: Re: Maybe the mucky mucks know something in this case ... posted by Not (a writer either) on December 18, 1999 at 20:56:31:
: "you're MISSING the POINT." The point at the beginning of this string was that the Osmosis Jones storyboard was incomprehensible.
Oh baloney. That is a lie. I've seen them.
If true, that may have been due to bad boarding, but if I were a betting man, I would put my money on bad scripting. The statement was then made that three hit animated features were made without tight scripts, which is complete and utter balderdash. Checking the scripts for "Lion King", "Toy Story", and "Prince of Egypt" will reveal all the main story points present and accounted for. Without which, the abovementioned movies BOMB.
Let me set you straight. Those three films not only didn't end up by the script but evolved away from the script that dragged them down. All of them had problems in the beginning by following scripts. Animation is visuals and it is rare for a writer to be able to put together that kind of script. It does happen, but is rare.
: "I can tell you're a writer, or you'd be pretty upset over this fact: writers for animation tend to get more credit than they deserve when it comes to animation--for taking ideas created by the storyboard artists and putting them in the script."
: Why do you think I'm a writer? Because I'm not caught up in the animator-writer cat fight? I'll match you year for year ... animating. I've wasted too many well-intentioned drawings on bad scripts to disregard the value of a good one. I don't care who gets more credit. Diligence always pay off.
You have probably wasted to many well intentioned drawings on bad boards. That is the final script in animation.
: Let's look at a film as a human body. The script is your skeleton, and the storyboard is your muscles.
HA!!!! The script is the inspirational thought. The storyboard is the skeleton. Animation is the muscle.
:Now, there's no doubt that a skeleton is pretty scary by itself. But without a script to hang your visual ideas on, a storyboard is just meat stew, spilling all over the place.
Yuk. Sounds horrible. Sorry, not that easy. Because film is visual the script can only give you peices of thought that you must weave into film making. No matter how strong the script if it is not torn apart and reassembled into a good storyboard you are dead. Dead dead dead. As Brad proved he was able to make the script into film because he was able to board it properly.
: And don't forget the contributions an animator can make to a "final, approved" storyboard. Creative energy must be continually added at every step, or entropy takes over.
: "In my 20 years in the business, I've had the joy to watch more than a few of these types fall FLAT on their faces when they actually have to produce interesting work."
Writers you mean. David Kirshner ?
: Writers and animation artists hate each other like Protestants and Catholics in Ireland.
Uh, I haven't shot any yet.
:Are animation writers overpaid?
Are they given too much power you mean. Sometimes, sometimes not. Who cares what they make.
:Are animation artists underappreciated?
Sometimes, sometimes overappreciated.
:Those may be valid questions, but to say that story points and successful plot resolutions aren't important?
Whooooooooo boy. You are putting words in peoples mouths. This is film making, not English lit. Of all the books and scripts I have never seen one word for word hit screen. Motives change, characters develope. That is the directors realm and where all real decisions are made. Even the producer is in on writing so do not think that because a writer is part of process that they come up with the important plots or storypoints. They write it but they are also being advised and guided.
:That's just plain absurd. You say you get joy from the failure of writers. Why not rejoice in good films?
Writers are a part of the team just as storyboard artists are. To give credit beyond that (as Ted Hughs deserved) belongs only to those who's original work a film is based on. Your line of attack ignores all the other people who contribute to the process.
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