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Author Topic: AN Contest #12 input
Charles
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It's getting to be about that time again. Here's what's been up with Brian Reynolds, AN's Contest Coordinator.

Brian and his wife Tracey recently relocated cross country. All the way from the Pacific Northwest to the East Coast and Virginia where they are both fine and Brian is working in a good job. A move like this takes time and a lot of work and worry as you can imagine. Things are settling in and soon he'll be here to get Contest #12 going.

Here's what we have to offer for the prize winners.

A year's subscription to Animation Magazine.

A year's subscription to Shane Gline's CartoonRetro.com.

One of Michel Gagne's books autographed by the author. I haven't worked this out with Michel yet but there won't be a problem arranging it.

Someone will get an AN t-shirt of their choice.

Of course, there's $100 in cash for first place.

We'll try and get more prizes from our members and expand the pool.

Here's what we really need. Your suggestions for making the theme of Contest #12 as encompassing as possible so that a variety of artists can participate. Designers, animators, background artists, comic artists, etc.

Also, how should we handle the prize situation regarding members who won from the last contest? Does it matter?

Thanks for your help, looking forward to your suggestions and ideas. Brian will be back before too long to organize the contest off of what goes on in this thread.

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mojodesign
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How about an Animation Nation version of VH1's 'I Love the (fill in the blank with a decade)'. The last entries could very well have been suitable for an 'I love the 80's' competition. We can take it way back too to lets say 'I Love the 20's'. That's just a thought. I'll try and come up with more ideas.

Oh how about exploring different cultures too. We can decide on a country and get everybody's take on something that relates to that country. That's great because it'll force participants to maybe do some actual research on the subject.

...I'll think of more...

Oh and about the prizes... I really do think that the best should always win what they deserve as well as be allowed to enter, regardless of whether they have won previously or not. Judging by the last efforts of the previous contest for artists to participate, I'd say we need all the submissions we can get. Not allowing an artist to participate because they won a past contest will only mean less submissions.

-MOJO

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gergley
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Yeah but you want to ensure that others ARE participating rather than a select few. Fresh faces.

If a good number of folks do paricipate...say, in numbers of tens or more then the grace period for re-particpation wouldn't be needed.

This is just my take, natch.

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Charles
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Do you think we should limit participation to members of the IE, or even to members of the site? Maybe open this one up to as broad a range of participation as possible with a wider array of prizes to offer.

I'm thinking the winner gets the cash, then second place gets the prize of their choice, third place the prize of their choice from what's left in the prize inventory, so on.

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roger
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I don't see anything wrong with letting everybody participate, at the moment its quite "difficult" to become a member to this site. (you can't just quickly register to just grab the $$). Also the community votes on who wins, so if the participants have won previously to me is irrelevant.
But you could come up with the rule that if a non IE member wins the cash price, that first the membership fee is deducted. For second and third i think Charles suggestion is fine.

Also it might not be a bad idea to set up the full and complete competition rules as i was a bit confused with the last one (duration, min. entry's etc).

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Eric Hedman
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I think maybe the contest should be to do a character design/viz def redo of something that already exists....

Like what sometimes gets dropped into the gallery.
But that we all can throw a few sketches at.

And also setting a judging criteria....like making it the most far out and appealing...or the most grosteque while still saying appealing. [Smile]

did I mention appealing?

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mojodesign
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Sweet! I like Eric's ideas....a grotesque Mickey Mouse perhaps?! A grotesque version of any character, really, would kick a$$....oooh like a grotesque Care Bear even. Awesome!

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mojodesign
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...oh and we can make them appealing too!

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Eric Hedman
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But they did that...they called it Runaway Brain. [Smile]

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mojodesign
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Damn, you're right. I wasn't familiar with it...I just saw some pics on google. Well what character would you suggest if you had your choice?

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gergley
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Maybe instead of something which already exists, what about something which doesn't exist?

Say, start out with a general description of the character and then any participants could intrepet it their own way. There'd probably need to be a stipulation that any participant would retain ownership of whatever they submit so noone would get weak in the knees about taking a try at it. (Well, maybe even emphasize that what you submit is indeed owned by the creator.)

I offer that take as an alternative to basing a contest with awards on working off of someone else's IP.

That said, I like Eric's notion of narrowing the subject to something more specific. And, I still like Brian's notion of whatever you come with within the theme. But, if people were confused or consternated by that open-ended theme then maybe narrowing it is best.

As for Who Can Participate?

I guess it wouldn't hurt to open it up to non-sub'd members. If it increases entries, cool.

As for winners numbered 2-4 choosing their prizes, that's a novel idea.


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2 cents, adjusted for inflation.

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SoleilSmile
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How about a vacation theme? Or an adventure we had (real or imaginary) from our childhoods?

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Trondheimfan
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Charles, maybe you should start a topic like this in general discussion, or side topics if you want more people participating.
I've been lurking here every day lately, and only just now noticed this thread all the way at the bottom of the site.

I'll try to think of some themes too in the meantime.

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Eric Hedman
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The reason I said something that already exists is because there are people out there who want to draw, but don't want to neccessarily take up a lot of time or energy.

One of our most successful challenges was to redesign Shrek. A reinterpretation.
When Gary started those, it kicked ass.

As a professional artist you have to get into the habit of budgetting time and setting scope and expectations....

Its my opinion that all contests should actually have more than just a catch phrase to base themselves on. They should bring out creativity in a more confined space than a three to 5 word phrase. That's way too open.

Sentiment should also not be a heavy determiner.
It should be about creativity. About the communication of an idea. Something that can be seen as successful outside of a remedial or art 101 class.
So there should be no explanations given for entries. Animation is a visual medium so unless something is a non-descriptive title or a sound clip like Tooned Bobs "I have a Balloon and You Don't" It should not be included.

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OFFBEAT
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How about "A Day Without An Illegal Immigrant?"

I already have an empty 405 freeway and a smiley face sun above it drawn..

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gergley
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Eric Wrote:
quote:
The reason I said something that already exists is because there are people out there who want to draw, but don't want to neccessarily take up a lot of time or energy.
One of our most successful challenges was to redesign Shrek. A reinterpretation.
When Gary started those, it kicked ass.
....

I totally agree on how narrowing the scope would be more conducive to a good start.
What I wrote above was about how a contest with awards may not be the most OK of things. Legally OK, that is.

Offbeat's Shrek re-design was just for fun. If prizes were involved then that could've only happened with permission from the copyright owner.

Hey, maybe I'm wrong and somehow Fair Use can be applied to this but I don't think Fair Use would apply. And, heck, maybe getting permission on an existing character is easy enough because the current prizes aren't huge like the prizes for finding Shrek on the inside of a Snickers wrapper would be huge. Ya know?
****************

That said, on second thought and after Previewing the above, I guess there are Public Domain characters to choose from...like hundreds of years worth and maybe even some cartoon characters, too. I somehow couldn't get past the notion that you were implying well-known, existing cartoon characters, like Shrek or others.

so, Yeah, the well of the Public Domain is something toes could be dipped into! And, hey, if potential participants couldn't come up with something before and this narrowing helps, cool.

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Charles
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A public domain title would be a good way to go. Maybe create a hypothetical development phase whereby an artist can choose what they'd like to submit. Character designs, background concepts, some frames from a storyboard, something animated, so on.

I've got an idea for three more good prizes we could add to the inventory. I need to check in with a couple of individuals about this but I'm sure they'll be willing to be a part of it.

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gergley
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That's sounds pretty cool.

Perhaps a good first step would be to solicite suggestions on the possible public domain characters. That'd be something for others to do while you are sorting out things on your end.

Then you could set up a poll to allow folks to vote on the best one.

Both of those steps should probably get prominent exposure via the Gen. Disc. Perhaps as sticky topics (use all caps if you think people may overlook them. )

You should also solicite more feedback about who can participate, Charles. Though, I suppose anyone reading this thread could chime in on that. That said, you may want to bump up your Gen. Disc. thread on this.

Take it easy,
G

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Eric Hedman
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Why not do something with Gullivers Travels?

It worked for Miyazaki. [Smile]

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Charles
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Good news! There's two more prizes that will be offered in Contest #12.

In addition to subscriptions to Animation Magazine, Shane Gline's CartoonReto.com and something from Michel Gagne, we'll be including autographed copies of the newly published "Mariachi Samurai" by Jose Lopez and Stephen Silver's book as well.

To check them out go to www.desoluz.blogspot.com and www.silvertoons.com.

Thank you, Jose and Steve!

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mojodesign
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SWEET! Alright, man! Let's get this thing going already! So what are you and Brian thinking as far as the theme?

...I have to take advantage of the fact that I'm not doing any freelance at the moment. If something comes up, I'm screwed...out of the contest.

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gergley
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"So what are you and Brian thinking as far as the theme?"
It is open for suggestions on the Public Domain Story Tip.

So far, Eric's is the only one.

To add, maybe a myth or tall tales (think: Pecos Bill and Paul Bunyon...ha...maybe RuPaul Bunyon...er...maybe not)....


Anyhow, I got bubkis beyond generalities.

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Greg B
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How about a 'Miss Animation Nation' contest toon?

Youse married guys are in trouble.

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Charles
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I could go with Gulliver's Travels. Any other suggestions?

We're also going to include a copy of Caracal's new storyboard book as a prize. So that gives us the 1st place prize cash, Animation Magazine, CartoonRetro, Jose's book, Steve's book, something from Michel Gagne, Caracals' book. That's seven prizes, six to choose from for the second and third place winners.

Is there a consensus here to open the contest to everyone regardless of subscriber status? Or even if they're not a member of AN?

Also, do you agree that the submitted work should be something original created especially for AN Contest #12 and not a pre-existing work?

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mojodesign
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Charles,

Personally, I don't mind if non members participated. It's all about the fun of competing for me....that is of course until I lose a few times to someone who hasn't paid their subscription fees (hehehe).

As far as Gulliver's Travels...sorry but I'm totally not familiar with the story. I'm sure I'm in the minority (I was never a big reader), but I wouldn't know where to start except to go out and quickly buy some Cliff Notes [Big Grin] Like I said though, I'm sure I'm in the minority...so I wouldn't get mad if that's what you guys decide on.

Where can we go to check out properties that are in the public domain, btw?

-MOJO

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gergley
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Mojodesign,
Beyond the library there are these:


Here's a Copy of the Book, "Gulliver's Travels"

It is long but it is humorous, especially if you have an idea of what he was making fun of.

The movie, which the Fleischers made, is also in the public domain. It can be downloaded here.

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mojodesign
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Thanks Gergley! I checked out Fleischer's film....it was great to see this historic piece of animation, but I did find it a little dull. It didn't really excite me...not even the overall plot. I'm sure the book is better, as they say. Could we have 3-5 themes perhaps that we could do a poll on? That might actually help with participation. It'll create some kind of hype before the contest.

Oh and Charles I do think too that all works should be created for the contest. That really levels the playing field.

-MOJO

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gergley
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No problem. Both are there to be shared.


As for another suggestion for a theme:

May as well play off of Eric's thoughts on keeping it as simple as possible so there is no need to explain so much. While there's a bunch of fairy tales which can be used and many of those have already been animated, there is one which has been made plenty of times but which is well-known, provides ample choices for the way that the contest is being structured and which is ready-to-go as far as interpretations go.

The Three Little Pigs.

Four characters.
At least four background designs.
It can be rendered humorously, realistically or even abstractly, you'd think.

But, most of all it is something which could ease the effort for potential participants. Because pretty much everyone knows the story.


Just throwing it out there.

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mojodesign
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Love it. Now we're talkin'.

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roger
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quote:
Four characters.
At least four background designs.
It can be rendered humorously, realistically or even abstractly, you'd think.

That might be a bit much (workload) for people who are working,
As for a story or a theme there are always people who will like it or not, i see nothing wrong with Gulliver's Travels: exotic/adventure/period, scaling (Proportion) issues.

other suggestions: Greek myths (enough material there to last a lifetime).
Quotes from plays: "Out, darn spot!" (MacBeth)

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mojodesign
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Hey Roger,

I totally agree, dude. You can't please everybody...that's why a poll is such a good idea.

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gergley
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Roger Wrote:
quote:
That might be a bit much (workload) for people who are working,
As for a story or a theme there are always people who will like it or not, i see nothing wrong with Gulliver's Travels: exotic/adventure/period, scaling (Proportion) issues.

Yeah. I could see how what I wrote might come across as too much to ask. I certainly didn't intend for it to sound less like an endeavor for fun to be done in one's spare time and more like a workload. So, I should definitely try to clarify what I wrote.

"Four characters. (to choose from)
At least four background designs. (to choose from)
(Any of it) It can be rendered humorously, realistically or even abstractly, you'd think."

For instance, someone could just submit a drawing of their take on one of the characters or their take on all of the characters.
Someone else could also choose to just draw one of the houses or an entire background scene.

If Charles' intentions are to offer the impetus for layout artists, background artists, storyboarders, character designers, fx animators and any else to come up with something and to do their thing then it would seem to me that The Three Little Pigs offers a lot of possibilities. If somehow the possibilities are too varied then I really don't know what to say about that.

Is The Three Little Pigs the only plausible theme?
nah. There should be others for consideration.

I would think that even someone who isn't planning on participating in the contest could toss a hat or two into the ring.

g

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gergley
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^ A hat = an idea for a theme.
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roger
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Gergley, in that case it will work, and a poll for a theme could work fine ass well.

(I will eat my hat if this competition does not take of [Smile] )

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Eric Hedman
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quote:
I could go with Gulliver's Travels. Any other suggestions?
Character Designs for Don Quixote by Cervantes.

Since the prizes are character design oriented it should be a character design contest.

If you could get some Storyboard stuff it should be a storyboard contest.

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If you got some background materials it should be about background/layout maybe using things gleaned from a storyboard contest.

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Cumulative things might live well together and make people better understand the "animation process"

We could have a writing contest developing the inciting incident from Don Quixote...."when his brain goes to mush from reading so many books of chivalry". For each contest you can have a poll and a guest judge to counter act the poll by half.

Like if Michel, (and)or Q were part of the Effects contest by being the guest judge, he/she could also critique the contestants in private e-mail if they so desired.
Then part of the prize for each person participating would be a xeroxed packet/book from a project the person had worked on.

We also end up building thrice the network in the process. [Smile]

Just an idea. [Smile]

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hamsterbite
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Just a quick topic idea.

Watching the Olympics was impossible to do without thinking of cartoon ideas. How about an Olympics theme or, if that seems outdated by now, some other sports theme? Backgrounds, characters, story sketches, layouts...

Of course it's true with any topic that if you're not specific - like with an actual sloga - some people will send work they've done already. I actually thought this was totally acceptable until recently. Several times, I told the history of a previously-finished entry as I submitted it.

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gergley
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"Character Designs for Don Quixote by Cervantes."

I can see that.

Don't get me wrong, Gulliver's Travels, the Olympics (sports in general) and the other ideas all have something to them. Each is more than do-able.

But, with Don Quixote there's a lot of possibilities. Not only for offering takes on the story but in the story itself there is a lot. It is also humorous.

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Caracal
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Hope Im not butting in here. Seems to me choosing such a humancentric and traditionally realistic subject like Gulliver is so narrow it cuts out too many styles and subject possibilities. I dont quite see the what the problem is with a general theme that would allow someone to do humans, animals, traditional illustration style, Tiki style, whatever.
Movie titles make great subjects
.
The Last Dance
Road To Perdition
Mimic
Three Kings
The Cell
Artificial Intelligence
Flight of the Phoenix
The Professionals
Clerks
On the Beach
The Last Wave
Ishtar
ShangriLa
Lost in Space
Lost In America
Lost in Yonkers
Lost Paradise
Lost world
Lost and Found World?
The Ref
Requiem for a (fill in the blank)

You get the idea. Any of these is open ended enough to be played seriously or as a joke. Human or animal or robots. Realistic or cartoony.

Cheers

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V Shane
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Or even suggest the blend of two stories,like:

Gullivers Travels & Lost in Space
Pirates of the Carribean & Over the Hedge


I would be highly interested in something that really stretches the imagination, not just rendering what has gone before. But then again I strive on concept art.

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gergley
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Caracal wrote:
quote:
Hope Im not butting in here. Seems to me choosing such a humancentric and traditionally realistic subject like Gulliver is so narrow it cuts out too many styles and subject possibilities. I dont quite see the what the problem is with a general theme that would allow someone to do humans, animals, traditional illustration style, Tiki style, whatever.
One, you aren't butting in. It is an open discussion...

Two, and perhaps this is just my take on it but... "Gulliver's Travels" isn't narrow nor is it limited in its possible interpretations.

It is probably not too far off the mark to think that there are dozens of different ways to interpret it. In large part because it is a cartoon take on a story, characters, etc.

Instead of human adults, the characters could be boys, girls, antelopes, bears, robots, elves, aliens or any number of types of characters. That's part of the beauty of cartoons, isn't it? Possibilities are numerous versus sticking to the script.

For another way to look at is:
I suggested the Three Little Pigs. Why would it have to be pigs? It could easily be three other types of animals or maybe people. Like, say, a mason, a lumberjack and a hippie.
Plus, it would not need to be a wolf as the antagonist, it could be something else. Like, a tornado or a skunk.

As for the "Don Quixote"... it could be an Egghead like character or a Goofy like character...the participant in the contest would be bringing their takes to the table. Whatever that might be...

I guess I'm looking at the public domain stories as more of a framework than as stricture. Of course, if there is to be strict adherance to the most famous versions of the story then perhaps that should be clarified.


Again, that's just my take on it.
Of course, and pardon me for being redudant, anyone can chime in.

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